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原帖由 小貓女 於 2009-6-9 11:14 發表
我想問下版主 .. 貓貓係咪真係唔食得生雞白 ??
但我好似見到 Dr.B 裡面都好似有雞蛋架喎
特別把蛋黄抽起,只餵生蛋白,是有問題的,不應這樣做,要連蛋黃餵。
引用:
BARF FAQ 5.5 有講 -
另一個被引述的實驗,是說吃生蛋可以導致Biotin的缺乏而死亡,因為生蛋白含avidin,會阻礙biotin的吸收。後來才知這個研究是在老鼠身上進行,連續不斷餵生蛋白直致死亡,然然檢驗是缺乏甚麼營養死的。(按﹕我有次在Discovery Channel上看到一種常偷雀蛋吃的動物,正奇怪牠們為甚麼不因為缺乏biotin而死亡。後來才在一個常見食物營養表中看到,biotin含量最高的常見食物竟然是蛋黃!大自然的奇妙,又一次嚇我一跳。)

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引用:
原帖由 BARFHK 於 2009-6-9 21:20 發表

特別把蛋黄抽起,只餵生蛋白,是有問題的,不應這樣做,要連蛋黃餵。
咁好唔好淨餵生旦黃ar

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引用:
原帖由 BARFHK 於 2009-6-9 21:20 發表

特別把蛋黄抽起,只餵生蛋白,是有問題的,不應這樣做,要連蛋黃餵。

即係如果連蛋黃餵生蛋白都無問題呀?

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引用:
原帖由 cattiew 於 2009-6-10 10:16 發表
咁好唔好淨餵生旦黃ar
咁啲蛋白點呀?如果倒咗佢就太浪費了,畢竟蛋白好有營養麻。

但如果你要蛋白來做mask,咁緊係餵淨蛋黃比佢地食。

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引用:
原帖由 叻叻 於 2009-6-10 11:41 發表

即係如果連蛋黃餵生蛋白都無問題呀?

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我有個印象,唔記得是cattiew定唯問過我餵alfalfa比貓吃的問題,我好像答咗,但是答應再叫Dr.B講深入一點。

現在完全唔記得係邊條thread講的(唉,早知聽阿娘講,後生時唔好成日劈酒,現在真係壞腦喇),但以下是Dr.B的說法:

Speaking to this, let me say that almost any nutrient or food in excess can be poisonous and that clearly, some animals species (and individuals within species) are more sensitive to certain compounds contained in some foods compared to others.  The degree of sensitivity does depend on their detoxification system (mostly in the liver), whose functions are in turn dependent upon the Evolutionary background of the animal in question.  Salt is a toxin in excess, as is protein, fat and water.  Kelp, which may be thought of as a marine version of Medicago sativa (Alfalfa or Lucerne) is toxic in excess – both for its salt content and its iodine content and probably for other reasons as well.  Indeed, most whole raw vegetables contain toxic materials and that includes refined carbohydrates – these too in excess act as slow poisons, compromising the mammalian hormonal balance, resulting, in hyperglycaemia, ketoacidosis and if untreated – in death.

It is a nonsense to say that the cat is not equipped to properly digest raw plant matter.  They have been ingesting raw plant material for millions of years – as found, often in great abundance, in the GIT of their prey, particularly small prey, which they ingest whole.  I personally have autopsied numerous feral cats (healthy cats, shot by farmers) and more often than not, their stomach contents have included large amounts of plant material.  It would be a brave person who would claim that cats do not obtain some benefit from this material.   For example, although they have lost the enzymes to convert beta-carotene to vitamin A (clearly they have not required to retain this enzyme system because animal prey is full of vitamin A), that is not to suggest for one moment that they do not obtain some benefit from the anti-oxidant properties of the beta-carotene (and other carotenoids) released from the cytoplasm of the broken down plant cellular material found in the intestines of their prey.

The claim that M. sativa should not be fed to cats on account of its poisonous principle(s) is instantly negated by making a simple observation.  Our cat products have always contained Medicago sativa and as a result, this supposedly highly toxic material has been fed to literally thousands of cats.   Not one of those cats has suffered as a result – indeed, cat owners are delighted with the improved and ongoing health of the cats that eat our foods.

We put it in there because of the obvious fact that cats have been receiving a benefit from the ingestion of small amounts of raw partly digested vegetable (plant) material [as found in the GIT (undigested in the stomach) of their prey] for millions of years – part of their evolutionary heritage.  Clearly, M. sativa is valuable as an unrefined and raw source of plant material, and from the point of view of its nutritional content, one of its most valuable components is its mineral content – most especially its trace mineral content.  There are other benefits of course, all well known, so I won’t detail them at this juncture.  What I would like to add is that the reason M. sativa has such an excellent mineral content is because of its incredibly deep root system – reaching often, more than forty feet into the sub-soil.  This is an area that has not been leached of its mineral content, an area untouched by modern fertilizers.  The problem with modern fertilizers such as superphosphate is that they tie up trace minerals, preventing crop plants from taking them up (even if they are present) at sufficient levels to meet the requirements of the eater.

I would be interested to know exactly how many cases of poisoning by Medicago sativa have been reported, how much was fed in these cases, the organ system (or systems) affected and the clinical outcomes in terms of death and/or illness – including all symptoms?   If there were deaths or illness, was the toxic principle (or principles) definitely identified?     Do they have information as to the levels of the toxic principles in the original ingested material and does this principle vary from region to region, season to season or between different strains of the plant?   Do the people making the claim that M. sativa should never be fed to cats have this type of information and is it from a reliable source – for example, is it information as reported by pathology laboratories – or are they working on hearsay and speculation?   

I have searched through some authoritative US texts to find information on this ‘problem’ to no avail.  The closest any of these texts comes to mentioning it is to say that some grasses cause gastrointestinal irritation – as mentioned in the article which claims that M. sativa should not be fed to cats (as per the link that you sent me - http://felineinstincts.ca/?p=642).

There is no mention of Medicago sativa or Alfalfa or Lucerne under the poisonous plant section in Current Veterinary therapy 14 by Bonagura – the latest edition.  This is perhaps the most widely used veterinary text throughout the western world and it certainly does mention a wide range of plants that are poisonous to cats.   I have also looked in my copy of Ettinger (not the latest, I must admit – but never the less – the year 2000 edition) and there is no mention of Medicago sativa (or any of its pseudonyms) as a poisonous plant.  I have looked at other authoritative cat books such as Sherding and similarly, there is no mention or listing of Lucerne (alfalfa or Medicago sativa) as a poisonous plant.    In addition, Dr. Pitcairn, perhaps the most well known and authoritative American veterinarian dealing with holistic matters, specifically recommends alfalfa as a treatment or therapy for cats in his book “Natural health for Dogs and Cats.”

Trust this perspective will be of some assistance to you.

As I have outlined above, I will definitely be most interested to hear of any authoritative information that suggests that M. sativa is dangerous to the health of cats.

Sincerely

Ian Billinghurst

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引用:
原帖由 BARFHK 於 2009-6-24 17:11 發表
Speaking to this, let me say that almost any nutrient or food in excess can be poisonous and that clearly, some animals species (and individuals within species) are more sensitive to certain compounds contained in some foods compared to others.  The degree of sensitivity does depend on their detoxification system (mostly in the liver), whose functions are in turn dependent upon the Evolutionary background of the animal in question.  Salt is a toxin in excess, as is protein, fat and water.  Kelp, which may be thought of as a marine version of Medicago sativa (Alfalfa or Lucerne) is toxic in excess – both for its salt content and its iodine content and probably for other reasons as well.  Indeed, most whole raw vegetables contain toxic materials and that includes refined carbohydrates – these too in excess act as slow poisons, compromising the mammalian hormonal balance, resulting, in hyperglycaemia, ketoacidosis and if untreated – in death.

It is a nonsense to say that the cat is not equipped to properly digest raw plant matter.  They have been ingesting raw plant material for millions of years – as found, often in great abundance, in the GIT of their prey, particularly small prey, which they ingest whole.  I personally have autopsied numerous feral cats (healthy cats, shot by farmers) and more often than not, their stomach contents have included large amounts of plant material.  It would be a brave person who would claim that cats do not obtain some benefit from this material.   For example, although they have lost the enzymes to convert beta-carotene to vitamin A (clearly they have not required to retain this enzyme system because animal prey is full of vitamin A), that is not to suggest for one moment that they do not obtain some benefit from the anti-oxidant properties of the beta-carotene (and other carotenoids) released from the cytoplasm of the broken down plant cellular material found in the intestines of their prey.

The claim that M. sativa should not be fed to cats on account of its poisonous principle(s) is instantly negated by making a simple observation.  Our cat products have always contained Medicago sativa and as a result, this supposedly highly toxic material has been fed to literally thousands of cats.   Not one of those cats has suffered as a result – indeed, cat owners are delighted with the improved and ongoing health of the cats that eat our foods.

We put it in there because of the obvious fact that cats have been receiving a benefit from the ingestion of small amounts of raw partly digested vegetable (plant) material [as found in the GIT (undigested in the stomach) of their prey] for millions of years – part of their evolutionary heritage.  Clearly, M. sativa is valuable as an unrefined and raw source of plant material, and from the point of view of its nutritional content, one of its most valuable components is its mineral content – most especially its trace mineral content.  There are other benefits of course, all well known, so I won’t detail them at this juncture.  What I would like to add is that the reason M. sativa has such an excellent mineral content is because of its incredibly deep root system – reaching often, more than forty feet into the sub-soil.  This is an area that has not been leached of its mineral content, an area untouched by modern fertilizers.  The problem with modern fertilizers such as superphosphate is that they tie up trace minerals, preventing crop plants from taking them up (even if they are present) at sufficient levels to meet the requirements of the eater.

I would be interested to know exactly how many cases of poisoning by Medicago sativa have been reported, how much was fed in these cases, the organ system (or systems) affected and the clinical outcomes in terms of death and/or illness – including all symptoms?   If there were deaths or illness, was the toxic principle (or principles) definitely identified?     Do they have information as to the levels of the toxic principles in the original ingested material and does this principle vary from region to region, season to season or between different strains of the plant?   Do the people making the claim that M. sativa should never be fed to cats have this type of information and is it from a reliable source – for example, is it information as reported by pathology laboratories – or are they working on hearsay and speculation?   

I have searched through some authoritative US texts to find information on this ‘problem’ to no avail.  The closest any of these texts comes to mentioning it is to say that some grasses cause gastrointestinal irritation – as mentioned in the article which claims that M. sativa should not be fed to cats (as per the link that you sent me - http://felineinstincts.ca/?p=642).

There is no mention of Medicago sativa or Alfalfa or Lucerne under the poisonous plant section in Current Veterinary therapy 14 by Bonagura – the latest edition.  This is perhaps the most widely used veterinary text throughout the western world and it certainly does mention a wide range of plants that are poisonous to cats.   I have also looked in my copy of Ettinger (not the latest, I must admit – but never the less – the year 2000 edition) and there is no mention of Medicago sativa (or any of its pseudonyms) as a poisonous plant.  I have looked at other authoritative cat books such as Sherding and similarly, there is no mention or listing of Lucerne (alfalfa or Medicago sativa) as a poisonous plant.    In addition, Dr. Pitcairn, perhaps the most well known and authoritative American veterinarian dealing with holistic matters, specifically recommends alfalfa as a treatment or therapy for cats in his book “Natural health for Dogs and Cats.”

Trust this perspective will be of some assistance to you.

As I have outlined above, I will definitely be most interested to hear of any authoritative information that suggests that M. sativa is dangerous to the health of cats.......
請恕我學識淺薄...
可唔可以翻譯一下呢 ????
謝謝..

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呢排比較忙,請等一等。

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一句講哂 : 小食多滋味, 多食壞肚皮

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hello 又係我

我在某本講人的生食書本裡看到以下一句:

"豆類不適合生食因為它含有會阻止分解蛋白質的酵素 - 胰蛋白酵素(Trypsin)運作的物質, 容易引起消化不良, 腹瀉和腹漲"

請問適合用在狗身上嗎?

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